Topic: The History Channel - Documentary on Climate Change (2007)

[boozehound420]

A good documentary showing the history of climate on this planet. How the last 10 000 years have gone up and down rapidly, and the jury is still out on why. http://www.vidstumbler.com/vid/830.htm

keep an open mind when thinking about global warming. If Co2 is to blame for our rescent average rise in temperature and we stopped pumping co2 into the atmosphere right now. The planet would still be changing on its own. History has shown us that this shit happens alot. Stopping the burning of fossil fuels is a worthy cause. We have seen how slight changes in temperature have large impacts.

BUT Theres no reason to think that our idea of the ideal situation where are societies are located is what the planet is going too settle on for a period of 10 000 years or so. And the rescent rise in temperature and extremly rapid melting of the glaciers that caught scientists of guard could trigger a new ice age.

I actually like extreme weather. Aside from the beauty of the weather itself. Society gets shaken up a bit and the strong and smart survive.

[KwinnieBogan]

It kills my Bandwidth but it was worth it, I guess I can't refute any of that really. form that it makes logical sense that we are continuing in an already established cyclic pattern, and that there was a discrepancy the would end the cycle that has co-oincidentally been filled by industrial emissions. I don't have a very strong opinion on the matter other than that either way global warming exists and we need to do something to buckle up for the ride.

[boozehound420]

Yep, if the population needs to go from 8 billion to 2 billion because it cant sustain itself. I will try my best to be in that 2 billion.

[Dark_Magneto]

That's what it can maximally sustain, not the number of people left standing in the bloody aftermath of the battle that determines who gets to stay.

[Real.PUA]

We arent at 8 billion yet... But we could get there and go higher, it just means the quality of life that we will enjoy will be less. I didn't watch the video, but just because the earth's climate changes on its own doesnt mean humans arent accelerating that change. The green house gas theory is very strong, and the atmospheric levels of CO2 are on the rise. The point is that reducing CO2 emissions will reduce the rate of change and make things easier for everyone.

[boozehound420]

quote:Originally posted by Real.PUA:

We arent at 8 billion yet... But we could get there and go higher, it just means the quality of life that we will enjoy will be less. I didn't watch the video, but just because the earth's climate changes on its own doesnt mean humans arent accelerating that change. The green house gas theory is very strong, and the atmospheric levels of CO2 are on the rise. The point is that reducing CO2 emissions will reduce the rate of change and make things easier for everyone.

Population is perjected to reach 8 billion in a couple years, 10 billion by 2020 I think. That wont change unless people stop having more then 1 or 2 kids.

Watch the video, they never said Co2 isnt the cause, but they did say global warming is likely to spark a new mini ice age. That will last for a few thousand years. Just like the last mini ice age.

This is from the ocean currents changing, not bringing the warmth up north. Which is very possible, and theres evidence thats what caused the 100 year ice age during the middle ages. Along with 3 large volcano eruptions that kept the ice age going for the time it did.

They also put forward some evidence explaining another mini ice ages that have happend in recorded history. One was one of the raises that build the pyramids in the jungles or whatever. THey recorded strange things happening with the sun. Probably solar flares.

Intresting stuff. The end was good too. If this happens when the world population is 8 billion. And the Earth can only sustain 2 billion. How does 6 billion people get of this planet. War

Ow and there theory is completly different then that movie about climate shift. That movie was working with the idea of the uppar atmosphere switching with the lower. These guys are describing what will happen if the ocean currents change. Since the ocean has 1000 more times the effect on climate then the atmosphere.

[This message has been edited by boozehound420 (edited 03-06-2007).]

[StealthyRacoons]

quote:Originally posted by Real.PUA:

We arent at 8 billion yet... But we could get there and go higher, it just means the quality of life that we will enjoy will be less. I didn't watch the video, but just because the earth's climate changes on its own doesnt mean humans arent accelerating that change. The green house gas theory is very strong, and the atmospheric levels of CO2 are on the rise. The point is that reducing CO2 emissions will reduce the rate of change and make things easier for everyone.

But CO2 one is only a fraction of the cause. CO2 is just the easy thing to rally around. Methane contributes so you gonna plug your ass.

[ProtextBlue292]

Global warming is because of humans you dumbfucks, we are offsetting the fragile balance of nature. No use of machines or pollution on a massive scale has taken place before the last 150-200 years or so in the billions of years that the world has existed. Yes we might be on a natural temperature rise but it shouldn't happen that fast. We definately are accelerating it a lot more than it should be happening. So who the fuck knows really whats going to happen.

[boozehound420]

quote:Originally posted by ProtextBlue292:

Yes we might be on a natural temperature rise but it shouldn't happen that fast. We definately are accelerating it a lot more than it should be happening. So who the fuck knows really whats going to happen.

The main point of this video is to show how the climate does change fast! And its the history channel. So guess what, they show the history if it changing fast. If its changing fast from Co2 or something else, its happened before and we know what will happen. Well these scientists seem pretty damn shur.



[This message has been edited by boozehound420 (edited 03-06-2007).]

[StealthyRacoons]

quote:Originally posted by ProtextBlue292:

Global warming is because of humans you dumbfucks, we are offsetting the fragile balance of nature. No use of machines or pollution on a massive scale has taken place before the last 150-200 years or so in the billions of years that the world has existed. Yes we might be on a natural temperature rise but it shouldn't happen that fast. We definately are accelerating it a lot more than it should be happening. So who the fuck knows really whats going to happen.

call me stupid but hasn't it only been like 3-4 degrees in 2 centuries. Shit more then a couple times in the past million it raised and lowered 10 times that. The point is that the earth is alot more resilient then we give credit for. Some of it is polution other is natural. Who knows if those new solar panels we sinked billions of dollars into actually get the material to arrange right we can switch to those and stop using power plants. But at 18% efficiency there not going to cut it.

[boozehound420]

quote:Originally posted by StealthyRacoons:

The point is that the earth is alot more resilient then we give credit for. Some of it is polution other is natural.

The earth will survive but civilisation wont.Well it will but with a far less number. And we will most likely have to start over, since i doubt people will go to school if the climate shifts so rapidly, for atleast a generation. If you actually watch the documentery they show how the Vikings were taken out by climate shift. And those pyramid builders (not egyption or mexican) were wiped out by climate shift aswell.

The earth is more then happy to jump in and out of heat waves and ice ages. Its an up and down process.

[This message has been edited by boozehound420 (edited 03-07-2007).]

[stick person]

past 10, 000 years have gone up and down rapidly.. it's been like that since earth started.

[niggersexual]

I just wrote a humungo paper on glaciers and climate change. Global warming is a crock of shit!

[jamesmcm]

There was a documentary on CHannel 4 (England) last night called "The Great Global Warming Swindle" it went into detail about why CO2 is not effecting climate change and the political agendas behind persuading people that it is.

Read about it here: http://www.channel4.com/science/microsites/G/great_global_warming_swindle/index.html

Search it on youtube if you want to watch it, it's in parts so i can't be assed to post them all.

[glutamate antagonist]

Yeah, that doc. was brilliant. Saw it last night.

quote:Originally posted by ProtextBlue292:

Global warming is because of humans you dumbfucks, we are offsetting the fragile balance of nature. No use of machines or pollution on a massive scale has taken place before the last 150-200 years or so in the billions of years that the world has existed. Yes we might be on a natural temperature rise but it shouldn't happen that fast. We definately are accelerating it a lot more than it should be happening. So who the fuck knows really whats going to happen.

Shut. The. Fuck. Up.

The planet is not so fragile that we arrogant humans can presume to be changing its climate. So what, we have a few thousand or so nests. Regular ol' animals still have the one-up on us when it comes to greenhouse gasses. Water vapour is the worst one.

AMAZING FACT: Volcanoes still give off a far greater proportion of CO2 in the atmosphere than humans!

So does the sea!

[Drefetr]

quote:Originally posted by boozehound420:

Population is perjected to reach 8 billion in a couple years, 10 billion by 2020 I think. That wont change unless people stop having more then 1 or 2 kids.

To claim that we will hit eight billion in just a couple of years is a bit of a stretch.

[lifejunkie]

quote:Originally posted by glutamate antagonist:



AMAZING FACT: Volcanoes still give off a far greater proportion of CO2 in the atmosphere than humans!

Is that so?

"globally, volcanoes on land and under the sea release a total of about 200 million tonnes of CO2 annually."

"the global fossil fuel CO2 emissions for 2003 tipped the scales at 26.8 billion tonnes."

"thus, not only does volcanic CO2 not dwarf that of human activity, it actually comprises less than 1 percent of that value."

How can you people be so stupid?

http://www.hawaiinews.com/archives/volcano_watch/000440.shtml

[This message has been edited by lifejunkie (edited 03-11-2007).]

[glutamate antagonist]

quote:Originally posted by lifejunkie:

Is that so?

Finally, a response from someone.

What I said isn't true. it seems. Although look at the people in this. Skip to 24.5 minutes and watch the cartoon. http://tinyurl.com/23ow6l

But: Where's the proven link between CO2 and temperature rise?

http://tinyurl.com/23ow6l

[This message has been edited by glutamate antagonist (edited 03-11-2007).]

[Ballin]

I actually caught it on TV...

it had some interesting points, but in the grand scheme of things, none of this is going to have an effect in our lifetime, so why bother worrying about it?

too much concern over random bullshit

if the world freezes over again, hooray, but not anytime soon http://www.totse.com/bbs/wink.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/wink.gif)

[Real.PUA]

quote:Originally posted by glutamate antagonist:



But: Where's the proven link between CO2 and temperature rise?

The greenhouse effect.

[boozehound420]

quote:Originally posted by Real.PUA:

The greenhouse effect.

with absolutly no way to measure the "greenhouse effect"

[DXM User]

I used to be worried about global warming, now I embrace it.

There's too fucking many of us; this is a natural function. The world rarely lets anything overpopulate, and when it does, it doesn't stay that way for long. Look at the dinosaurs --- they got out of hand and nature fucked their shit up.

Earth 1, Animals 0

[MasterPython]

If people are causing global warming what can actualy be done about it. Davis Suzuki said on his show a few years back that with al countries meeting their Kyoto goals the ocean curents would still come to a grinding halt by 2060. I have read an article saying that if all humans disapeared from the planet tommorow it would still take a century or so for globabl warming to stop.

If you take into acount that western civilisation has been growing unsustainably for hundreds of years since they ran out of trees In Europe to burn for charcoal and swiched to coal. There is no way to reduce output without killing off a huge portion of the population and going back to a medevil level of technology.

[lifejunkie]

quote:Originally posted by boozehound420:

with absolutly no way to measure the "greenhouse effect"

Oh, it's easy to measure.

You make a prediction: If too much carbon dioxide in the atmosphere will raise global temperature after a measurable delay, then if if we find a way to measure temperate and co2 concentration in the past, the graphs should look the same only shifted by a time constant.

And that is exactly what happens.

[delusional_reality]

although you are perfectly right lifejunkie and I respect you and all but just making a graph of one thing against another and there seems to be a correlation between them like directly proportional etc doesn't necessarily mean it is actually the cause of something.

for example: http://www.seanbonner.com/blog/archives/001857.php

just for the record I do believe that increasing CO2 levels is causing an advanced greenhouse effect, which is directly linked with global warming.

[Sir_Fos]

quote:Originally posted by MasterPython:

If people are causing global warming what can actualy be done about it. Davis Suzuki said on his show a few years back that with al countries meeting their Kyoto goals the ocean curents would still come to a grinding halt by 2060. I have read an article saying that if all humans disapeared from the planet tommorow it would still take a century or so for globabl warming to stop.

If you take into acount that western civilisation has been growing unsustainably for hundreds of years since they ran out of trees In Europe to burn for charcoal and swiched to coal. There is no way to reduce output without killing off a huge portion of the population and going back to a medevil level of technology.

[Sir_Fos]

quote:Originally posted by MasterPython:

If people are causing global warming what can actualy be done about it. Davis Suzuki said on his show a few years back that with al countries meeting their Kyoto goals the ocean curents would still come to a grinding halt by 2060. I have read an article saying that if all humans disapeared from the planet tommorow it would still take a century or so for globabl warming to stop.

If you take into acount that western civilisation has been growing unsustainably for hundreds of years since they ran out of trees In Europe to burn for charcoal and swiched to coal. There is no way to reduce output without killing off a huge portion of the population and going back to a medevil level of technology.

You're right that not much can be done. People act as if only the U.S. had signed on to the Kyoto Protocols everything would be fine. This totally ignores the developing worlds growing hunger for electricity and cars.

China itself is planning on building close to 600 new powerplants by 2012 which, conservatively, will emit about 1.8 billion tons of extra CO2 into the atmosphere every year. In fact China's extra emissions will outweigh the combined savings from the kyoto treaty by about 5 to 1.

Doubtful that they'll let enviromental concerns hault their progress.

[Real.PUA]

quote:Originally posted by delusional_reality:

although you are perfectly right lifejunkie and I respect you and all but just making a graph of one thing against another and there seems to be a correlation between them like directly proportional etc doesn't necessarily mean it is actually the cause of something.

for example: http ://www.sea nbonner.co m/blog/archives/001857.php (http: //www.sean bonner.com /blog/arch ives/00185 7.php)

just for the record I do believe that increasing CO2 levels is causing an advanced greenhouse effect, which is directly linked with global warming.

Now if only quantum theory predicted that pirates would cause global warming.

[lifejunkie]

quote:Originally posted by delusional_reality:

although you are perfectly right lifejunkie and I respect you and all but just making a graph of one thing against another and there seems to be a correlation between them like directly proportional etc doesn't necessarily mean it is actually the cause of something.

for example: http ://www.sea nbonner.co m/blog/archives/001857.php (http: //www.sean bonner.com /blog/arch ives/00185 7.php)

just for the record I do believe that increasing CO2 levels is causing an advanced greenhouse effect, which is directly linked with global warming.

I'm just oversimplifying.

At any rate, the time delay is a necessary condition for causation in this case.

The models for the greenhouse effect far predate the discovery of a mechanism to measure past CO2 concentration and temperature.

[Real.PUA]

Here's something that can be done.

Pill stops cow burps. (http://environment.guardian.co.uk/climatechange/story/0,,2040615,00.html)

[This message has been edited by Real.PUA (edited 03-23-2007).]

[boozehound420]

How many of you guys actually watched the video? It wasnt discussing Co2 at all. It talks about what will happen in the future, co2 or not. THe ocean currents change, northern hemisphere goes intoa mini ice age, the rest fucken boils.