Dolphin species dies out

[shitty wok]

A victim of pollution, overfishing and traffic. The first victim of China's unchecked growth, and there likely will be others http://www.cbc.ca/technology/story/2007/08/08/yangtze-dolphin.html?ref=rss

[gforce]

very sad. And im sure it's not the first species to be wiped of the map by China. We are facing an ecological crisis with a mass extinction happening now (30,000 species are being lost each year). How much longer can it carry on for until entire ecosystems just collapse. :(

[Trousersnake]

That sucks, what suprises me a little is that there are none in captivity. Weren't they not considered a threatened species and put into an Aquarium or something? God damn

[shitty wok]

That sucks, what suprises me a little is that there are none in captivity. Weren't they not considered a threatened species and put into an Aquarium or something? God damn

If they can't profit, its no use to them. Its a soulless state.

[Slave of the Beast]

And the human species should care because...?

[Dark_Magneto]

We are facing an ecological crisis with a mass extinction happening now (30,000 species are being lost each year). How much longer can it carry on for until entire ecosystems just collapse. :(

And the human species should care because...?

Yeah, why should humans care about mass extinction? It's not like we require living things or ecosystems or any of that hippy shit in order to survive.

Worst case scenario is we finally get off our lazy asses and create the technological singularity, upload our minds onto computers, and be done with all this environmental nonsense.

[Slave of the Beast]

Yeah, why should humans care about mass extinction? It's not like we require living things or ecosystems or any of that hippy shit in order to survive.

That is assuming we depend on those species for our survival. Which in the case of flipper here, we don't. You will notice I haven't paid any attention to your histrionics about mass extinction, seeing as that isn't what I was responding to. Even if I was, the same logic applies, if we don't depend on, or can find no use for an ecosystem, why must we waste time and energy preserving it?

Worst case scenario is we finally get off our lazy asses and create the technological singularity, upload our minds onto computers, and be done with all this environmental nonsense.

You and your poxy singularity...just install a fucking "Off" switch already.

[Experimental]

That's really sad.

[gforce]

That is assuming we depend on those species for our survival. Which in the case of flipper here, we don't. You will notice I haven't paid any attention to your histrionics about mass extinction, seeing as that isn't what I was responding to. Even if I was, the same logic applies, if we don't depend on, or can find no use for an ecosystem, why must we waste time and energy preserving it?



You and your poxy singularity...just install a fucking "Off" switch already.

Each species holds a niche in an environment. Remove that and you stand a chance of destabalising an ecosystem. Im not sure on the particulars of this dolphin but for example this dolphin could eat predators of other smaller fish. With out those dolphins predator numbers will increase hence decreasing the number of smaller fish that we may eat.

A similiar example is bees. We don't directly depend on them for any sizeable amount of food yet they fertilise a massive portion of our food crops and with out them we would be screwed.

[Slave of the Beast]

Im not sure on the particulars of this dolphin...

That much is obvious, but watching you blow smoke rings out of your ass is amusing none the less.

A similiar example is bees. We don't directly depend on them for any sizeable amount of food yet they fertilise a massive portion of our food crops and with out them we would be screwed.

Similar examples:

1) An insect that certain sections of global human food production, heavily rely upon in order to function efficiently.

2) An aquatic mammal whose local relationship with the human species is so important, that you have so far failed to define it.

Yes! Yes, now that you mention it, I do see the similarities.

[gforce]

1) An insect that certain sections of global human food production, heavily rely upon in order to function efficiently.

2) An aquatic mammal whose local relationship with the human species is so important, that you have so far failed to define it.

Yes! Yes, now that you mention it, I do see the similarities.


maybe not as important directly as bees for humans which have a primary role in fertilising crops but each species depends on each other and knocking out species can start almost a 'chain reaction' resulting in the collapse of ecosystems.

Anyway who wants to live in the world where the ONLY animals around are animals that are directly useful for us? Some bees, sheep, cows and chickens and a few fish. Thats it.

[Real.PUA]

Whatever the value to the ecosystem, this extinction is at least symbolic of the ways in which we as people are negatively affecting the environment.

"This represents the first global extinction of a large vertebrate for over 50 years, only the fourth disappearance of an entire mammal family since AD 1500, and the first cetacean species to be driven to extinction by human activity."

[Slave of the Beast]

maybe not as important directly as bees for humans which have a primary role in fertilising crops but each species depends on each other and knocking out species can start almost a 'chain reaction' resulting in the collapse of ecosystems.

Is this the case with this species of dolphin? I very much doubt it.

Anyway who wants to live in the world where the ONLY animals around are animals that are directly useful for us? Some bees, sheep, cows and chickens and a few fish. Thats it.

I think you'll find that list is far more extensive. In any case, aesthetics do not interest me and the only time you're likely to see a great white shark or a komodo dragon* is on national geographic. Just buy a DVD recorder and you'll never notice they're gone.

* ironically, these two should go on your list!

[gforce]

Is this the case with this species of dolphin? I very much doubt it.

So removing an entire species from an ecosystem has no effect on it at all? And with the state that the Yangtze is in i doubt this is the first species to die there, all these species going extinct add up to a huge problem.

[Slave of the Beast]

So removing an entire species from an ecosystem has no effect on it at all?

Are you being deliberately obtuse?

I've repeatedly asked what is the point of maintaining a species or ecosystem, when its removal would have no discernable negative impact on the human species. The extinction of this dolphin, as far as I can be bothered to look, has had no negative impact on the local or global human population. The ecosystem may indeed be doing metaphorical handstands over the species' demise, but that is irrelevant to my question unless it affects humans. I get the impression you're evading my argument regarding species and ecosystem maintenance, because you can think of no logical reason why we should maintain a non-useful species or ecosystem.

And if you believe the loss of this dolphin species is a major blow to the local or global human populace then, for the love of Christ, tell me precisely why. Define the specific mechanism by which humans can categorically be shown to be less better off overall.

And with the state that the Yangtze is in i doubt this is the first species to die there, all these species going extinct add up to a huge problem.

Supposition.

[gforce]

We have caused massive problems ecologically in this world through agriculture, deforestation, industrialisation, pollution, taking of natural resources, the list goes on. It is my belief (obviously not yours) that we should try and preserve the world so that species and ecosystems don't die because of our actions. I can't explain the reason why i want to keep them alive and why our actions shouldn't kill them, it's just a feeling. Like why do people love and care for rabbits, cats or dogs as pets? Becuase they "love" the animals and want to be able to share that experience with others. Obviously you don't have that same feeling that I do.


And after less than 5 mins searching i found this information talking about the Yangtze:

'Annual harvest of fish aquatic products dropped from 500 000 tons in the 50s to about 100 000 tons in 90s. Fishermen are even afraid to eat fish when they manage to catch some because of heavy pollution. Only last year 26 billion tons of waste was dumped into the river which runs through 11 provinces.'

When you consider that the 80% loss of fishing catch is equivilant to 70% of the entire UK's fishing catch you will see what pollution and overfishing has done to the catch on one river alone. Protecting and ensuring the safe environment of the dolphins by cleaning up the pollution will mean that other species are saved aswell which mean sustainable fishing rates can be resumed in time. Now freshwater fish in China are caught at the rate of 1.9-2 million tonnes a year. That means that the drop in 400,000 tonnes is equivilant to 20% of China's output which incidetally has the largest fishing fleet and output in the entire world.

The 26 billion tonnes of waste which ends up in the Yangtze is also a big problem for human health. By protecting the dolphins and other species we are protecting 350 million people which live in the Yangtze river valley. Also the building of the 3 gorges dam could create the worlds largest cess pool with the 450 mile long reservoir becoming infested with all sorts of horrible diseases and illnesses. Also by using the dolphins as a vector for support we can help ensure that the millions which depend on the Yangtze for there water aswell as livelyhoods can carry on using it without dying

[Zhao]

You're roping together figures and statistics from all over the shop; stop it. And I'm sorry, but the dolphins are already dead.