I Have Found Hell...

[Metalligod]

***B.S. DISCLAIMER.Some ppl might find this to be a stupid thread. The only thing I can say to those ppl, is well, often when I see a post that's stupid to me I don't post there. A lot of other ppl do this as well and the post gets swallowed further and further down the page, til it's not even on the the page anymore.***



Ok, ealier I've said that maybe Earth is hell. Well maybe this maybe isn't a maybe at all.

First let me say that the bible uses the word 'in', in the stead of 'on'. The bible says Satan and his followers were cast out of Heaven, to hell.

Revelation 12:9, says he was cast to earth. Wouldn't this then mean that hell is earth?

In the begining of earth's existance, it was a place of fire, and stones, and lava(river of fire). Being an angel and seeing Gods' work, in motion, I think it amazed them. Maybe seeing as this is the way the earth started, the first way they saw it. God and his angels speak of it this way.(Eternally a place of fire and brimstone)

Because it is they way they first saw it, the will forever remember it this way. Just a thought. Just another one of, or piece of, my theories.

[This message has been edited by Metalligod (edited 04-11-2004).]

[evolove]

I wouldn't be so literal if I were you

[Metalligod]

quote:Originally posted by evolove:

I wouldn't be so literal if I were you

Elaborate

[This message has been edited by Metalligod (edited 04-11-2004).]

[skoolboy_arts]

to all u fucked up non-catholic christians (protestant,methodist etc.) what ur doing is sooo fuckd up and wrong!!! like you my friend!!! you dont just read lines from one gospel!!!! it will mislead you!!! every story in the bible has a moral lesson,and thats the message of that gospel/story!! just dont believe in one line u dumbfucks!

[evolove]

***This is my own disclaimer, mines just shit, I might edit later, but I don't think it would survive a major operation, sorry Metalligod, I would have liked it to be better, but I'm so damn tried, I should never have started, but it's going to have to do for now***



You seem have come up with you idea based on this equals that, when it's not realy thought through.

Your saying that we are cast to Earth, which is Hell, it's just that Earth itself is given the discription being fire and brimstone. I don't know why you have meantioned Angels seeing Earth this way as I don't think they're responsible for Hell being referred to as such a place. Plus they had vissited the Earth after it was formed. When hell is referred to in the Bible it is in the context of being another place seperate from Earth. It would have to be our delusion, and that of the prohets of God, that were not in Hell. Which would kind of void any of the writing from the Bible, as the 'divine' knowledge it's based on is flawed, and this is the knowledge that your basing the assumptions on.



Miester Eckhart wrote that, I got this from Jacob's Ladder-an impressive film I might add- that there are no such things as Angels and Devils, that where one would see an Angel, another would a Devil, it matters what we are attached to, and what is being taken/given.

This is an idea that closely relates to how I see hell.



This is about Satan being cast down to Earth, one of my major sticking pionts with what you wrote.

I go for the figurative meaning which is based on the interpretations of Eastern mystics and to a lesser extetnt, Jewish ones, though on this, as far as I've read, they're in very close agreement.

Moses was given by God two sets of "Laws" one was written down, the other was an oral law passed down from Him. This is Qabbalah, which teaches methds for a person to come into direct contact with God, from this, and part of the method itself, comes a deeper understanding of the Biblical texts, divine in it's source, not just born of human theory. This is one reason why I listen to these types of people/schools before the fundamentalist types.

I was going to write a nice and elaborate piece about the symbolism of the Garden of Eden, the Tree of Life and Satan siting in the Tree of the Knoweldge of Good and Evil, but I don't have the understanding, I think perhaps somebody else would be more apt to take this up, or maybe just correct me.

The Garden of Eden ->microcosmicly the body, the chakric system, and states of concsiousness, macrocosmicly the different worlds, earth being the lowest, 'Kingdom'-I've forgoten the Hebrew name, this is concerned with our normal waking state, identified with the body and the information attained by the physical senses.

Adam is the Yang, masculine and Eve Yin, feminine, Pingla amd Ida in the yogic traditions, Satan is the Kundalini energy, which is not quite right, but I'm a little rusty, and it's a pretty complex piont in itself. Interesting to note, that Kundalini is also represented as a Snake in yogic texts.

(there is a little difference, as the first "Trees" are said to be perfect, and in a Perfect Tree, say a Buddha, there is no chakra that is related to our common level of consiouness. In Qabalah this is lifted up to become Daath, which is I think the gateway to the negatively-existant roots of the 'tree' ie. the state of God-Union or Nirvana. Kingdom is related to physical limitations, but this only occurs in a "Fallen" tree, which MAY be related to Adam and Eve being kicked out of the Garden. I might be able to pick this up later if I do some research or some thought. There are differences in the Chakric Systems of Qabbalah and Yoga, from what I know the Yogic system doen't deal with perfect trees, for one reason they've no need for such things, however differences arn't suprising as both addmit to there being many different chakras that they don't dierectly deal with, and as they're related to perception are not so much concrete as A and B, which could also bring in the word of the Hebrew and Sanskrit alphabetes and aspects of mystical thought on these and interpretation of scriptures infolving this. Sorry about that I'll get back to the piont)

The snake is in the tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil, temping Eve she talks Adam into tasting this fruit which God has forbiden, this knoweldge is of duality, specificaly between God and Man, sinking from a non-dual state of union with God, to a state of perception of seperatness or not perceiving God at all, this I guess could be hell, and is indeed at least a part of it. But as Buddha said, Nrivana and Samsara are one. Though our inabilty to see this is the delusion we suffer from. They taste the fruit of this, the perception of it and realise they are naked -they're attention or consciousness becomes centred in/on they're bodies, or body.

Satan descends to Earth, the Dust, the lowest chakra, and becomes a destrutive force that seperates man from God. An Adversary that has to be overcome (adversary is the name given to Satan in th Old Testement, and see Jesus about 'overcoming.')

[Craftian]

quote:Originally posted by Metalligod:

***B.S. DISCLAIMER.Some ppl might find this to be a stupid thread. The only thing I can say to those ppl, is well, often when I see a post that's stupid to me I don't post there. A lot of other ppl do this as well and the post gets swallowed further and further down the page, til it's not even on the the page anymore.***

So we should tolerate your bullshit just because you don't have answers to things that we think are true?

[ihaveatorso]

Uh...the earth kicks ass. Maybe you should open your eyes every once in a while.

[The Crusader]

I thought that once you were banished to hell, you still had your recollection of just why you were put there in the first place? But as we only know of this one life and as the vast majority of the world's population are religious I seriously doubt we are all hell worthy. Never mind in hell. Surely hell wouldn't hold such beautiful scenery and have a complete lack of nasty, fiery demons and burning rivers of torture etc

[Metalligod]

Your saying that we are cast to Earth, which is Hell, it's just that Earth itself is given the discription being fire and brimstone.

I haven’t a clue, what post you read. Cause not once did I say we were cast to hell. I stated things as clearly as possible, how you got that above, out of me specifically saying: The bible says Satan and his followers were cast out of Heaven, to hell. Revelation 12:9, says he was cast to earth. is beyond my knowledge.

I don't know why you have meantioned Angels seeing Earth this way as I don't think they're responsible for Hell being referred to as such a place.

For what I hope is the last time, I’ll say this: In Hebrew the angels were called ‘The Watchers’, these creatures witnessed creation. So this would then mean that they’ve seen earth in its first earliest stages. Science says when the world was in its earlier stages it was a place of fire, lava, and some cooled rocks.

Science and the bible are the reasons why I say that angels saw it this way. And if I’m not mistaken, isn’t Revelations spoken by an angel?



Plus they had vissited the Earth after it was formed. When hell is referred to in the Bible it is in the context of being another place seperate from Earth.

Show me where it (hell) is spoken by God or an angel to be another place separate from earth. Yeah they visited earth After it was formed, but while it was forming it was indeed a place of molted rock, and fire. This science proves.

It would have to be our delusion, and that of the prohets of God, that were not in Hell.

Ok, I’m not saying were not in hell. I’m saying we possibly are.

Which would kind of void any of the writing from the Bible, as the 'divine' knowledge it's based on is flawed, and this is the knowledge that your basing the assumptions on.

Something can be flawed and still have some truth in it, and to believe that something is completely dismissible because it has flaws in it, is imbecilic. I don’t believe in a god, or God. But I believe that it is very possible that one could indeed exist. Vampires are not completely folklore.

The stories told of them about their abilities are overrated. However, there is a disease that makes people vampire-like and it is proven that human blood does indeed, assuage the symptoms of the disease.

And garlic does harm a person with this condition, and the gum-line does retract making it seem as though the teeth are elongated, like fangs. It’s unintelligent to completely dismiss something, because it has flaw in its structure.

And for anyone who’s going to try and accuse me of lying the disease is called Poryphoria.

Miester Eckhart wrote that, I got this from Jacob's Ladder-an impressive film I might add- that there are no such things as Angels and Devils, that where one would see an Angel, another would a Devil, it matters what we are attached to, and what is being taken/given.

This is an idea that closely relates to how I see hell...

Just because you or anyone else has a idea of hell, does not mean it is true, and it does not mean that other ideas are inadmissible. I believe that Satan is not evil and I have a version of events that could have possibly happened, that are reasons for his banishment. But it doesn’t mean that it’s true.

Just like you have an Idea about Satan I do as well, one could possibly be the truth, so don’t just dismiss everything that is not what you believe. I have the bible(including the book of Enoch), the Hebrew bible, and logic to back up my theory. Just as you have with yours, but we can only speculate as to what truly happened.

[This message has been edited by Metalligod (edited 04-11-2004).]

[Metalligod]

quote:Originally posted by skoolboy_arts:

to all u fucked up non-catholic christians (protestant,methodist etc.) what ur doing is sooo fuckd up and wrong!!! like you my friend!!! you dont just read lines from one gospel!!!! it will mislead you!!! every story in the bible has a moral lesson,and thats the message of that gospel/story!! just dont believe in one line u dumbfucks!

Bitch I'm not even Christian, don't use this as your little posting place to bitch and moan. Talk about the fuckin subject. Did you not read my B.S.DISCLAIMER. If you don't like it don't post. If you have an opposing view then post it. But don't come in here with your imbecilic whining!

If I were Christian I wouldn't even be thinking of things happening in a way other than what the bible states, you stupid whinny BITCH!