Faith?

[Lion eats man]

Hello, I have often heard people make remarks along the lines of “I would only believe in God if there was conclusive evidence that he exists” or "I'd believe if a giant came from the sky in a fiery blaze demanding to be worshiped".

Faith is required to believe in God. Hebrews 11:6 clearly states that without faith it is impossible to please God. Facts, evidence, and the such render faith useless.


This has probably been stated numerous times before but I would like to see the respond to this, or the discussion that stems from this.

[The_Brammig]

Tell that to the guy who says he has a logical basis for his faith.

[Q777]

Yes, Facts and evidence render faith useless.

[xray]

Most atheists are without belief in God/gods because the claim that any exists is an extraordinary claim (based on the miraculous attributes most give to God/gods). Most skeptics are of the healthy opinion that extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, not necessarily "conclusive evidence".

It seems you are claiming that since the Bible says that it is impossible to please God without faith, this somehow makes God's existence any more plausible. Sorry, doesn't work that way.

[AngryFemme]

Originally Posted by Lion eats man

Hello, I have often heard people make remarks along the lines of “I would only believe in God if there was conclusive evidence that he exists” or "I'd believe if a giant came from the sky in a fiery blaze demanding to be worshiped".

Believing with conclusive evidence is one thing. Actually subscribing to it is another. One could even believe in the actual "force" of the claim, as recanted in earnest by trusted others - but submission is the end-all, and some people are just comfortable going through life without clinging to a Higher Power to guide them along.

[Martini]

Originally Posted by Lion eats man

Faith is required to believe in God. Hebrews 11:6 clearly states that without faith it is impossible to please God. Facts, evidence, and the such render faith useless.

Does this god want as to have faith (you seem to be defining it as belief without evidence, as do I) in all sorts of things? Or does He think it's only good with regards to Him? Is believing in things without evidence actually a good attribute for humans to have? I think history and common sense would tell you that it isn't. You wouldn't trust that a mechanic is the best in town merely because his sign says "Best Mechanic in Town", would you?

If He (the Christian God you're mentioning) wants us to believe in Him without evidence, how are we to know to choose him over any other god? How would it be fair for Him to not save someone who chooses Islam (or one of the other multitudes of religions) as a religion and not Christianity, when this person is most likely trying to be of the religion he believes God wants him to be?

The Christian god (if I recall correctly) claims something along the lines of being all-good. An all good god would not refuse to save those that are doing their best to do what they believe is right and real. This is one of the reasons we don't need "conclusive evidence" that He exists. The contradictions within the Bible are enough evidence to believe your Christian god cannot possibly exist as He is being described.

[Spike Spiegel]

Originally Posted by Lion eats man

Faith is required to believe in God. Hebrews 11:6 clearly states that without faith it is impossible to please God. Facts, evidence, and the such render faith useless.

Why should I have to take my time to please a non-existent deity?

I think the real question is, why aren't you pleasing (worshiping ) Poseidon? Those Hurricanes just don't occur by themselves, and it's obvious that it's his mighty triton at work stirring up those hurricanes...

I believe this, because I have "Faith" that it is true... and that's all that is required my friend

[Lion eats man]

Originally Posted by xray

Most atheists are without belief in God/gods because the claim that any exists is an extraordinary claim (based on the miraculous attributes most give to God/gods). Most skeptics are of the healthy opinion that extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, not necessarily "conclusive evidence".

My use of the term conclusive in my original post is correct. A claim of that magnitude, or an extraordinary claim like you put it requires evidence which is rock solid, irrefutable, without a shadow of a doubt.

Originally Posted by xray

It seems you are claiming that since the Bible says that it is impossible to please God without faith, this somehow makes God's existence any more plausible. Sorry, doesn't work that way.

Never said that, nor is that my point. But it does make having faith in God more plausible.

I'll reply to other posts later.

[Rust]

If you read the rest of Hebrews 11, you'll see a long list of people who had faith, even after the Christian god presented himself to them. Like Abraham and Moses, for example.

If a burnish bush suddenly began to talk to me, or if an angel came to stop me from killing my child (after god had commanded that I do so), then I sure as hell would consider that conclusive evidence that a god exists. Obviously, god sees no problem with this.

[boozehound420]

you MUST have faith in the giant pink dildo in the sky, if you dont it will ass rape you for eternity.

Do you believe?