So over 1 billion people believe in immaculate conception!?

[gadzooks]

Alright, so concepts such as heaven and hell, and an almighty creator, I can kinda see why some people might believe in this stuff. Aspects such as these of religion mainly have to do with faith, not reason. I can (to a degree) understand that.

But for over 1 billion of this world's population to actually believe that some chick 2 thousand years ago was impregnated by God... Like, come on... Seriously.

Or are there some rational Christians* out there who realize that Mary must have had sex with SOMEONE to bear her son Jesus?

The main question here I guess is: Does being a Christian necessarily mean that you believe in immaculate conception?

*I realize that rational Christian is a bit of an oxymoron, but I assume (or at least hope) that there are some reasonably level-headed Christians out there who at least try to gain some understanding of their beliefs, rather than just blindly accepting whatever they are told.

[Punk_Rocker_22]

I remember reading something somewhere about how an "angel" came to visit her to say God would give her a child. But it was written in an almost conspiracy theory ish way about the some guy was this angel and he fucked her. If anyone has more info, pass it on.

[Real.PUA]

Immaculate conception refers to some stupid catholic belief (redundant) about the mother of jesus. Virgin birth is what you are thinking about, and that's basic to all forms of Christianity AFAIK. Some individual Christians might not believe in that miracle.

[The_Big_Beef]

Once you submit to Jesus you're not allowed to ask questions.

[AngryFemme]

Originally Posted by The_Big_Beef

Once you submit to Jesus you're not allowed to ask questions.

You're allowed to ask questions, but the answers must be taken from The Book. If they don't fall within the pages of The Book, then it falls under the "God works in mysterious ways" catch-all category of answers.

You either settle on it, satisfied with that explanation - or you don't. If you do, then it's considered a show of strength for your faith. If you don't, then it's considered a weakness of your faith.

If you're going to submit to Jesus, be prepared to stop asking so many questions and just learn to live with mystery.

[JesuitArtiste]

Originally Posted by AngryFemme

You're allowed to ask questions, but the answers must be taken from The Book. If they don't fall within the pages of The Book, then it falls under the "God works in mysterious ways" catch-all category of answers.

You either settle on it, satisfied with that explanation - or you don't. If you do, then it's considered a show of strength for your faith. If you don't, then it's considered a weakness of your faith.

If you're going to submit to Jesus, be prepared to stop asking so many questions and just learn to live with mystery.

But then again, should a believer really be considering what other people think? Just because they think that questioning God is a lack of faith doesn't mean it is. There are many answers not in the Book, it doesn't tell me how to stack a shelf, make a bed, or grow a flower, just because it isn't in there doesn't mean you should not look for answers. That is merely a dogma of the Church, and God knows we have enough people that disagree with the church for me to excuse mysefl from saying how gay the church is.

Jesus repeatedly informs his followers that to get into heaven they must be like little children, and do children not ask questions?

[AngryFemme]

Originally Posted by JesuitArtiste

But then again, should a believer really be considering what other people think? Just because they think that questioning God is a lack of faith doesn't mean it is. There are many answers not in the Book, it doesn't tell me how to stack a shelf, make a bed, or grow a flower, just because it isn't in there doesn't mean you should not look for answers. That is merely a dogma of the Church, and God knows we have enough people that disagree with the church for me to excuse mysefl from saying how gay the church is.

I was speaking specifically of Bible-related questions, in the context of: Ask your pastor/priest/minister ... but don't be surprised to get the "God works in mysterious ways" answer from church officials.

Jesus repeatedly informs his followers that to get into heaven they must be like little children, and do children not ask questions?

Good point. Which goes back to - why would Jesus deny someone entrance in heaven if their only "sin" was that their unanswered questions led to them disbelieving in God? This is assuming that the person was of solid moral character in every other aspect, of course.

[The_Big_Beef]

Originally Posted by AngryFemme

Good point. Which goes back to - why would Jesus deny someone entrance in heaven if their only "sin" was that their unanswered questions led to them disbelieving in God? This is assuming that the person was of solid moral character in every other aspect, of course.

Because his dad thinks you're a shit...

[JesuitArtiste]

Originally Posted by AngryFemme

I was speaking specifically of Bible-related questions, in the context of: Ask your pastor/priest/minister ... but don't be surprised to get the "God works in mysterious ways" answer from church officials.

Fair enough, I guess I was just being picky

Good point. Which goes back to - why would Jesus deny someone entrance in heaven if their only "sin" was that their unanswered questions led to them disbelieving in God? This is assuming that the person was of solid moral character in every other aspect, of course.

Personally I have a very liberal reading of the bible and don't think that God would punish someone for not believing.

I'd justify this by saying that belief is a term we try very little to understand. When we say belief we seem to think that saying you believe in something is enough to say that you believe something. I think belief is more complicated than that. Personally I think that maybe it is enough to be moral regardless of whether you say you believ in God or not.

Of two people, one who bears the title of a christian and yet acts un-christian and another that acts in a manner shown by Christ, which of the two is more the Christian?
Is God so simple that he requires words to show devotion in him? Or is God great enough that regardless of what someone says he can see that they have true faith, in the form of doing good for goods sake. If the greatest commandment is Love, the the one who loves is following God's desire more directly than anyone claiming to follow him.

[KikoSanchez]

Originally Posted by gadzooks

The main question here I guess is: Does being a Christian necessarily mean that you believe in immaculate conception?

Yes, I see no metaphorical interpretation of the term 'virgin birth'. This is in fact how I became de-Christianized. In one day I became a deist and also realized it was a complete rejection of the bible and could not be reconciled.