Interview With An MRTA Leader
"The Light At The End Of The Tunnel"
January 19, 1991
The Tupac Amaru Revolutionary Movement, founded officially in
1984, but whose origins come out of the experience of different
Peruvian leftists forces during the 70's, is a political and military
organization seeking revolutionary change in Peruvian society.
According to one of its leaders, known as Comandante Andres,
Peru - in the context of Latin America - embodies the entire
spectrum of possible conflicts: economic, social, cultural, racial,
political.
In this exclusive interview, granted by the MRTA leader to
Barricada International in Mexico, its concept of the armed
struggle, its differences with Sendero Luminoso, and the
spectacular escape from the Canto Grande prison are discussed.
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We developed as a political and military organization, not to follow
a specific ideology, but because the Peruvian people's historic
conditions have always been characterized by the ruling classes' use
of violence.
We took the name Tupac Amaru because he symbolizes the
Peruvian people's struggle against their oppressors. Tupac Amaru
was drawn and quartered in the square in Cuzco after leading an
anti-colonialist rebellion which almost shook off Spain's
domination of a large part of South America.
The fact is that this history of violence used by the oppressors made
us realize that the only way to achieve a radical change in Peruvian
society was through the use of revolutionary violence. We formed
ourselves into a political and military organization because our
central policy is to develop armed struggle without devaluing any
political action we might take.
Our first armed actions were in the cities, although politically we
had almost national coverage. In 1987 we made the leap and
became a rural guerrilla movement with the idea of building the
Tupac Amaru Popular Army.
We think of the Peruvian revolution as a process having many
facets, a political and military process. It's a process taking place in
the countryside and the city, that is, a process incorporating all
forms and possible aspects of revolutionary struggle.
Sometimes it's easy to analyze how wars start, but it's difficult to
figure out how to end them. In Peru we think there's a pre-
revolutionary condition with some of the traits of a revolutionary
situation. We think the defeat, not of the government, but of the
regime, of the imperial social and economic system, and the
building of a new model through revolution, through armed
struggle, is possible.
However, we've always said that it isn't the MRTA that's going to
make a revolution in Peru, but the Peruvian people, through their
numerous social and political organizations, within which the
MRTA has an important role.
We aren't saying we're the vanguard, the only vanguard. We're part
of that social vanguard which experience shows us is what achieved
revolutionary triumphs in this stage of humankind's development.
What differences and what affinities are there between the MRTA
and Sendero Luminoso?
There's more that separates us from than unites us with Sendero
Luminoso. Sendero is a profoundly dogmatic, sectarian movement
which believes that its leaders' ideas express a qualitative
development, a fourth stage of Marxism-Leninism. We have
conceptual and concrete differences in the practice of revolutionary
struggle.
Sendero is characterized by its negative image. They don't seek to
win hearts and minds, but impose their direction on the people,
which is why they don't hesitate to kill to achieve their dominion.
Sendero is also characterized by its cruelty, which is strongly
repudiated. The Peruvian people understand the need for
revolutionary struggle, but don't support that kind of struggle, that
kind of inhumanity.
I would hesitate to describe Sendero as a revolutionary group
because their Pol Pot concept of life and revolution is long way
from what we think of as revolution. But at the same time, Sendero
achieved a certain strength because of certain actions it took. In
1980, when almost all leftist groups became legal, Sendero began
the armed struggle at a time when other organizations were saying it
wasn't possible. At first it generated a lot of sympathy within
diverse social sectors. Many people joined Sendero. The problem is
that later, through its actions, it showed its true character and that
objectively limited its growth.
How do you spread your ideology? How do you approach people?
We say that without the people there is no revolution. So, our aim
is to approach and involve ourselves closely with the people. The
kind of actions we carry out - aside from the political work done by
the organizations at various opportunities - is armed propaganda,
mainly in the cities.
We do things like expropriate food from the big supermarket chains
and hand it out to the people. We support the people's struggles, a
professional organization or a union carrying out some political-
military actions which help and support that struggle. We're present
in various urban and rural professional organizations and peasant
unions, in a purely military aspect. For example, as both urban and
rural guerrillas, we concretely strike at the enemy, the armed forces
and the police, who are becoming more and more like occupation
forces within their own country. They're forces who are always
blood-stained, highly corrupt, extortionists of the people. We take
concrete action against them in any way possible.
How do you define the MRTA ideologically?
We try to put Peruvian reality ahead of any pre-defined political
ideology. We hope to build socialism because capitalism has not
been, nor has the possibility of being the solution to the Peruvian
people's problems. That's not to say that we're going to build a
socialism styled and modeled after the eastern European countries,
a model which failed in practice. We're proposing the building of a
socialism appropriate to conditions in Peru.
We don't want state centralism or the bureaucratization of Peruvian
society. Life has taught us that that is not the way. We should have
a democratic, very participatory society; not an electoral democracy
every five years, but a democracy where men and women get
involved in their workplace, their community, their neighbourhood
and decide their own destiny. We want it to be a participatory
democracy with the people as the actors. It has to be that way.
You captured public attention with the escape from the prison
known as Canto Grande. What can you say about that?
It's our policy to free companeros who fall into enemy hands. We
know that a Tupacamarist fighter who falls into enemy hands is
systematically tortured. That's always the case in Peru. One of the
members' fundamental duties is to look for any means of escape,
once they've been taken prisoner, and it's the organization's duty to
look for a way to free them.
The rescue of the companeros who were in Canto Grande prison,
which is Peru's maximum security prison, was conceived nearly
three years ago. We saw the need to build a tunnel into the prison
from the outside. When the rescue took place there were 47
companeros, including eight women and Comandante Rolando
(Victor Polay), who is the organization's commander-and-chief.
We built a tunnel 330 meters long. Approximately 25 companeros
took part in the excavation of that tunnel, under extremely difficult
conditions. I think it's the longest escape tunnel of any Latin
American prison, and maybe in the world.
An infinite number of problems had to be solved, like light, water,
and ventilation, as well as coordinating the companeros' escape,
since they had Comandante Rolando isolated in one cell-block, the
men in another and the women in yet another. There had to be very
precise and decisive coordination in order to achieve a successful
escape.
We counted on a great deal of the people's ingenuity. Peru is a
mining country and there are mine-workers who have experience
with tunnels and are our companeros. Their participation was
decisive above all in a building a tunnel that wouldn't collapse,
ventilation problems etc.
Another problem was finding the right direction so we would come
out at exactly the right spot inside the prison. We used all kinds of
instruments for this, like a theodolite compass, and we tested our
own ingenuity. In the end we rescued everyone.
No one was killed or captured?
All the companeros who left - there were 47, plus one common
criminal who slipped in with us - are now at their posts. Some are
with the guerrillas, others in the cities, but everyone is in the
revolutionary struggle again.
Is there anything else you'd like to say?
I'd like to send greetings to our Sandinista companeros and tell
them that despite the set-back they've had, the revolutionary
struggle in Nicaragua has made a fundamental contribution in terms
of creativity, imagination and courage and, in that sense, we're sure
that the Revolution, despite the difficult moments, will always
prevail in Nicaragua.
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